MSN - not ranking

Hi

I know I'm on MSN somewhere, but ranking sooooooo badly at the moment. I've got some links and I'm working on getting more - I know from reading the posts that this is important.

How many links does it take to get any sort of ranking? I am trying to get a ranking for baby gifts which I know is quite competitive, but when I look on googlerankings.com I'm not anywhere (top 1000), on MSN, Yahoo or Google.

I will keep plugging away at the links, but I just wanted to check that I'm not missing something obvious.

If people was able to know how many you need, well there will be no point of doing seo beacuse all the people will now the forumla, so the ranking process will not be worthless... or at least a profession...

Talking about the original post... MSN is very easy if you want to rank on him you need alot of backlinks all you can get will bust your rankings, but that will not help you as much in yahoo and certainly not for google... why for google not, well hehe thats other type of thread...

Yes, I guess there's no hard and fast rule. Funny think with the links though is that I just thought I'd check a few of the sites with link:www.... and one of them only had 2!!

Admittedly that was on p20 or something BUT it's still better than me.

So does MSN have a sandbox too? I thought it was just google?

Take a look at your competitors links and you can get an idea of what you are going against and what you need to do to gain a top position. MSN is fairly easy. You just got to see what your competitor is doing.

See post above - I did look, and one of them only had 2 links! I have more than that but appear nowhere. Admittedly most of the others have hundreds.

If it's really mostly about links I'll just keep plugging away at it then. Thanks!

just put some words high on your page and msn will love you.
a few links will help as well.

msn is just too easy to rank so it is a good one to learn on

Yes you are right. Optimizing your page is profitable with MSN. And yes Littleperson links are what matters especially in MSN where the quality isn't a big deal. If you need any help in getting links you can catch me on MSN/AIM.

No! It's not funny. Well, I suppose it is, but it's not strange.

I'll explain - understand, though, that this is my opinion only:

To rank well in MSN (or Yahoo, Google, etc. for that matter) I'm not convinced that sheer numbers of incoming links are the answer.

My experience is that my sites beat others not by numbers but by quality.

Ok, I'm not in comemrcial areas. Well that's not really true, I am in some, but not insurance / bank loans / casinos etc.

But I am never surprised to see a good quality site with a few good quality links outranking sites which have spammy numbers of unnatural incoming links.

What Search engines want in the 21st century, is to be successful. To do so they need to supply their users with quality results.

It's a difficult job because there are so many people trying to exploit them in order to make money - and they use spam techniques to do so.

I won't say that spammy technique doesn't work, but I will say that it's not the only way to go - in fact, for me, it's NOT the way to go.

And I out rank some of these people; and I have very few incoming links. I have quality content and chosen quality links.

...and I have natural links which come as a result of being well placed and on topic.

The days when the only way to rank was to amass an enormous amount of incoming links are all but gone. Hooray!

Some say it may even hurt your ranking position... I don't know - I haven't and won't test that one...

Just my old O

MCS
x

You would be right with google but on MSN the quality really doesn't matter. Just about any link will be counted so it is overal sheer numbers of links which get high MSN positions. On Yahoo it is high numbers but they must have some quality. With Google they must be QUALITY links.
I hope Fathom doesn't mind me quoting him. Fathom says that links to a site will not hurt you it is what you link to. I generaly believed this to be sure but did think that 1000s of bad links to your site could hurt you but according to Fathom and two other SEOs it won't so I believe majority vote wins ;)

Put nice meta description and some bold letters in the pages. It helps in MSN

Use that the H1, H2 and H3 tags depending on how large the home page is get links with your targetted keywords in the achor text and you should be up there in no time. With MSN it takes me about a week to get top positions for general keywords. If they are very competitive it can take much longer.