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    Unexplained Google Penalty


    Has any one witnessed with this recent update any complete drops out of the Google Index, meaning loss of all backlinks, PR, rankings for no reason what so ever. And I am not taking about sites that spam, interlink, etc.. Only good quality, optimized, and relevant sites that deserve to be in the top listing for their hard work.

    I have observed this twice today on two different sites, that were before this update PR5 & 6, all with unique content, and quite unique backlinks.

    I wanted to see if any one has observed this as well?? The unexplainable. I am too the opinion that some of these sites might have been hit with a duplicate content penalty even though there appears to be no duplicated content. Its walks and talks like what happens witha duplicate content penalty.
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    I thought with dup content that the only penality was that it drops one of the pages, rather than a PR / SERPS penality?
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    Not necessarily, I have seen many cases were entire sites get dropped for the fact that they get tagged as duplicate content. Backlinks, PR is gone. Now you are correct partly in that Google will drop a page from the results or rank it below a page that had the original content. Its not a site wide type penalty. It could be a manual penalty, possibly. However duplicate content penalty are really tough to estimate and pinpoint unless you can find multiple examples of the same content appearing on other sites.
    For example, I wrote an article about Inktomi back several months ago. Within 2 days it appeared on just about every emarketing site that could pick it up. Some people asked to publish it, others didn't. Yet when I do search for the article name, I get all the sites that have it hosted on their site. Now 2-3 months later when I check the search again, I find that some of the sites that had the article around the time I published it are no longer in the results, either that or they are pages deeper in the results. Some didn't even budge from top 10 or top 20 in the results.

    I am just trying to see if others had observed similar so I could start to see some patterns. Its could very well not be a duplicate penalty at all, it could be completely an interlinking issue. It just difficult to tell sometimes.
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  7. Savior of the Whales
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    [QUOTE=Phoenix]loss of all backlinks, PR, rankings for no reason what so ever.[QUOTE]

    Hi phoenix, i guess there must have been some reason, and IF it is not appearent and these sites really are clean .... then my next guess is that the "infastructure" google has created to POLICE backlinks has somehow MALFUNCTIONED & CANNED them .....

    I have read recently about a handful of sites that said they got "canned" recently for selling links .... (they placed a group of unrelated outlinks on their site is all they appear to have done to get whacked) .... they said their site wnet from pr7 to pr = 0 things like that ....

    are these sites you know well or sites you just heard of .. ??
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    Hey Joe,

    Good point, I don't know about Google being broken. But the selling of backlinks is a good point. I do know one of the sites quite well, it quite the nice site, and is optimized expertly, and did very well up until recently for a ton of phrases. Then poof! Disappeared. The owners of the site which happen to be friends are besides themselves freaking out that Google is "doing evil" even they have a strict "do no evil" policy as stated recently. The other site is one I have monitored for 6 months, and did some optimization for a quite awhile back before they forgot about it (which is commonplace), and erased over all the work I did, and saw their rankings drop last month...duh! Well not only did they lose a good optimization, but went to a PR0 for unexplained reasons. All of the sites are completely clean, they sell no links whatsoever. They may have some purchased links but from what I can tell they are from legit sites, possibly. Or at least from what I can tell.

    Regarding the site you mention that got penalized, how do you think Google caugh on. Where they just plain stupid, and advertise selling links or was the site already penalized and they were just selling the PR.
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    Phonix, first off i am sorry for that 2 websites.

    But, how relevant thats sites backlinks? i mean related:www.site-A.com.
    I think we have a new PR-BL filter here. For example; if your website related with travel but all your backlinks related with tect/computer then Google is applying filer/penalty.

    Please look at this post: New Google Update? -> #93 ->
    Hmm.. i take that back.

    Looks like the PR has updated as I check around. It also looks like they have put a filter or a large penatly on seochat.com links

    Hexed
    and this post: New Google Update? -> #113 ->
    Well, when sites have 400-500 backlinks from forums and still are PR4, it makes you wonder how much PR is actually transfering

    Hexed
    I examined his websites and realized that Google is applying a kind of BL-PR filter. So, i guess you have same problem.
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  13. Savior of the Whales
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    I just noticed reading about 3 or 4 people here this week who had a similar story (" i put up 15 or 17 unrelated links and my pr went from 7 to 1 or 0) ..... i dont know the details really are .... maybe they had really bought some sorry backlinks to get the pr7 so they could sell some links to start with and then their support links just fell apart .... but that is a good question phoenix .... it does not seem that google has some "link seller" automation detection program ..... i could show you examples of what most would consider as obvious sellers that still have PR .... ( here is one i run across today ... www. **** yourbestdeals.net/ ) ... so there must be a more rigorous standards of when the sellers get whacked .. ....
    i happen to know of some pretty extensive link far operators ... ( after florida they converted their "networks" which coulld NOT BUY a decent serp .... and started using them to FEED a few semingly independent sites with PR ... i checked a few of those today and they still seem to have similar PR to what i recall them having .... but they are not selling large groups of outlinks ... they use all their PR transfer to send to their own group of ON THEME and seemingly indepent sites .... so it dont look like a "seller mo ... ie links to a large group of topically unrelated sites at bottom of page" ...

    if you figure out what kind of penalty the people you know got ... please post it ...honestly i bet it is an accident of somekind ... i would be AMAZED if google ever came out with some kind of new penalty that did not whack some of my sites out of the box ... and i've had nothing dissppear recently .... ;)
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    Know this thread is several weeks old, but I wanted to highlight what the two problems were with the sites I saw dropped from Google.

    First Site: Traffic Power penalization for mouseover redirects

    Second Site: Duplicate Site Penalty, quality of backlinks checked and any ?? ones were removed.

    Not so unexplained now. :-)

    Ben
    Last edited by Phoenix; Jul 14th, 2004 at 05:25 PM.
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    Talking


    Well, Ben, this proves that if a site gets banned, there is ALWAYS a reason for it. People saying that "Google is broken" or has glitches and such things have no clue of what they are talking about.
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    Hey fryman,

    I totally agree, there is no such "Google hates me" penalty or "Google broke down this morning" penalty. With about 10,000 computers, if one goes down they got penalty to back it up. lol. A penalty is only unexplainable when all possible reasons for removal have been exhausted, and its when I look for new causes for penalties, and solutions for reversal.

    :smile:

    Ben
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    By the way, wanted to tell you I love the original avatar pictures, even though they scare me from time to time. Especially the cat one (one with big eyes). hehe.
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    Question


    Originally Posted by Phoenix
    First Site: Traffic Power penalization for mouseover redirects

    Second Site: Duplicate Site Penalty, quality of backlinks checked and any ?? ones were removed.
    how did you get such detailed knowledge about what exact penalties were applied and why?
    i mena i haven't found anything like a page at google which lets you check your current list penalties
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    Well cause I partly know what to look for cause I have gotten sites out of penalty before, and part lots of research into possible penalties, part a thorough detailed look at the whole website, its linking, incoming links, html, server information, and past and current methods of promotion such as techniques, etc..

    Unfortunately, Google doesn't list possible penalties, but they do publish information in terms of webmaster guidelines that is a help in narrowing down the cause.

    http://www.google.com/webmasters/guidelines.html

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    Originally Posted by Phoenix
    Well cause I partly know what to look for cause I have gotten sites out of penalty before
    Sure - I have managed to get a penalized (totally removed) site back to G within a few weeks by removing the spam and never do it again. With the G "sandboxing" in your back head it's worth the try to get a penalized site back in the index.

    I would love a list of possible penalties - reason and penalty - if anyone have one (a suggestion) please post it?

    I'm sure G loves the situation - no one know for sure if/when they can be banned. That's create a situation of self censorship - as know from former east block countries and other countries with semi democracy is self censorship far more efficient than censorship where all knows the rules.

    HC
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    That "in and out" of google status is google trying to warn you that you F'ed up and actually giving you a time to fix your mistake of cross linking or duplicate content. I wish I had taken notice instead of bombardment of inbound links to try and resolve the situation.
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