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    MajesticSEO, OSE, AHrefs - What reason do we have to use these tools?


    MajesticSEO, OSE, AHrefs - What reason do we have to use these tools?

    SEO 2013:
    1. We know that these tools are not showing all the links.
    2. Even if it does - We don't know which link is useful and which doesn't, because these tools are not providing us this information.

    So I'm asking again - What is your reason to use and pay money for these tools?
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    1. We know that these tools are not showing all the links.
    True, but I would argue that there is sufficient sampling that you can
    a) identify some valuable links
    b) determine the ratio difference between sites (so absolute values are less important)

    2. Even if it does - We don't know which link is useful and which doesn't, because these tools are not providing us this information.
    You do get useful link metrics information that allows you to determine the value of a link so I consider it useful data.

    ome of the tools also give you useful facilities to determine on-page factors you should be looking at, help you get a full picture of what is going on with your site and generally provide a better picture of things to assist you in your SEO campaign.
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    You do get useful link metrics information that allows you to determine the value of a link so I consider it useful data.
    Can you mention please one name of an SEO tool that give's you a value of a link?

    Do you understand what is it means a value of a link?

    I'll make it simplier:
    today we know that Google gives you some good points and bad points for every link to your site. Every link is earn his "good points" over time. If the link is usefull to the users and clients - it will give you good points. If the link is just there (and it can be a spammy link, or just unsuefull link from unuseful blog) to be a link to your site - you can receive bad points from Google.

    So I'll ask again:

    Do you know what is it a good link? Do you have a tool for that?

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    • tstolber : attitude
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    Can you mention please one name of an SEO tool that give's you a value of a link?
    SEO Moz Pro

    Do you understand what is it means a value of a link?
    Yes, do you?

    I'll make it simplier:
    No need, but if you feel you need to simplify something very simple in the first place, knock your self out.

    today we know that Google gives you some good points and bad points for every link to your site
    This is not true, we do not know that you get good or bad points. We do know that it is possible to get a penalty if you have a certain kind of link profile but it is not known that Google gives good and bad points. I think you may be confusing the Page Rank algorithm where a link from site A to site B is seen as a vote for site B from site A.

    Every link is earn his "good points" over time
    This doesn't make sense.

    So I'll ask again:

    Do you know what is it a good link? Do you have a tool for that?
    Yes, a good link is one of high authority that has lots of relevant pages linking to it, is relevant to my site and ranks well in the search engines for related keywords to the one that I am targeting.

    Yes I do have a tool for that (in bold for some reason) it is called SEO Moz Pro. It gives you a Moz rank for each URL. This is normalized to search engine results and correlates quite closely so is a good approximation to the ranking algorithm that Google uses. I take the Moz rank and relevance and look at the number of links in and out of a URL and get a value. This is how I determine the value of a link.

    I also use 13 years of experience, my brain and human intuition along some other tools and processes that I have built up over the years.

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    • Ann Smarty agrees
    • DarrenHaye agrees
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    The thing is that backlink tracking is so much more than trying to understand which of the links affected your (or your competitor's) rankings.

    I apologize for to somehow changing the focus of the discussion, but answering the initial question, "what is the reason", I can say, the reasons are plenty!

    Here's some data I evaluate for any of my competitors / clients using MajesticSEO:

    "Links that probably need to be fixed: empty anchor text":


    "Some of the influencers who probably work for my competitor: need to investigate further":


    "My (or my competitor's) product favorite / best linked page"


    "Which links have I lost" (and why??)


    "Least trusted links to my competitor" (of course, you'll need to click those sites to figure why they might be considered low-trusted but the machine at least gives you some clues):


    There are so many questions backlink research helps you to answer that I am surprised you ask!

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    • europa agrees : Great answer...glad Jim recruited you to Admin here. We r lucky to have your input.
    • tstolber agrees : Great answer
    Everything will be ok in the end

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    Thank you tstolber and Ann for your answers.
    Unfortunately these not the answers I was looking for. These answers are what Google wants you to answer me and europa and the rest of the forum.

    These answers belong to 2011 - Where all the competitors trying to get as many links as they can. Or as tstolber said: "high authority that has lots of relevant pages linking to it". All of the competitors are using this same methods and the same tools. Try to think widely. When you have 100 competitors that are trying to get the first place in google, and using these methods (you both mention) - only 10 succeed, the rest will fail. And you know what is the next thing when you fail? Yes, PPC.

    There is a reason why the first place is there, and I promise you none of this tool is supplying you the answer.
    Last edited by Buts; Jan 14th, 2013 at 04:48 AM.
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    Originally Posted by Buts
    Thank you tstolber and Ann for your answers.
    Unfortunately these not the answers I was looking for. These answers are what Google wants you to answer me and europa and the rest of the forum.

    These answers belong to 2011 - Where all the competitors trying to get as many links as they can. Or as tstolber said: "high authority that has lots of relevant pages linking to it". All of the competitors are using this same methods and the same tools. Try to think widely. When you have 100 competitors that are trying to get the first place in google, and using these methods (you both mention) - only 10 succeed, the rest will fail. And you know what is the next thing when you fail? Yes, PPC.

    There is a reason why the first place is there, and I promise you none of this tool is supplying you the answer.
    If you think you don't need to use these tools, or rather they don't help you determine the value of links, then why on earth did you start this thread? All you have managed to do is make yourself look quite silly by not taking the answers above which have explained to you just what those sites/tools are for, but if you think link building is something you can't do because your not as good as your competitors at it, maybe you should look to be working in a different job!?

    By any chance are you one of these SEO haters that claims the death of seo at least once a year lol?

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    • tstolber agrees
    Last edited by NathanielB; Jan 14th, 2013 at 05:44 AM. Reason: Added question at end :)
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    Said tools provide metrics, only. When comparing them with actual results there are conclusions to draw that will give you an answer to your question in almost all cases. It's application of common sense that will provide value to those metrics - not the numbers themselves.

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    • tstolber agrees : Very true & well said
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    Originally Posted by forexoon
    Said tools provide metrics, only. When comparing them with actual results there are conclusions to draw that will give you an answer to your question in almost all cases. It's application of common sense that will provide value to those metrics - not the numbers themselves.
    You would have thought the OP would know this already as he kind of half answered his own question with:
    Originally Posted by Buts
    There is a reason why the first place is there, and I promise you none of this tool is supplying you the answer.
    Which is he had any sense and knowledge of SEO he would know that very little is handed to you on a plate and so you need to work it out for yourself, especially when it comes to links because one link maybe of value for me, but of no value for you!

    Look at it this way Buts, tools are just that, tools to help you do a job, not to do the job for you!
    Would a screwdriver put a shelf up for you? No, its the tool that's been created and widely use to make the job easier for you!

    Now take that those same lines and change them to link building because these tools have been worked hard on to give you a better understanding of the links, not to tell you what links will be best to try and gain a link on for your site!

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    • Ann Smarty agrees
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    Would a screwdriver put a shelf up for you?
    No, the shelf is coming with instructions that telling me exactly what to do to succeed my "mission".

    These tools are also coming with some instructions and info about what is a good link and a bad link, if you will work as mr.forexoo said:

    Said tools provide metrics, only. When comparing them with actual results there are conclusions to draw that will give you an answer to your question in almost all cases. It's application of common sense that will provide value to those metrics - not the numbers themselves.

    So my question is:
    How the hell these tools can provide me a value to those metrics?
    How the hell these tools can provide me any information or value or whatever from the best company to work at in the world? From the company that getting our personal information more than 5 years - gmail, chrome, analytics, wmt and there is more and more.

    All these answers you gave me are still tactics that working on manipulating the the search engine. It is a tactic that based on links (these tools provide me information about links).

    You really think Google will let these 100$ tools some way to learn their algorithm?
    Now don't confuse yourself. I'm not asking these questions because I'm saying "SEO is Dead" or something like that (the first time someone said it in the net was in 1997). No, it is not what I meant.
    I'm trying to have a "healthy" conversation here, and look for tomorrow. Because yesterday Google started to punish all the manipulate tactics. Remember that Panda and Pinguin are just 2 algorithms that Google told us they have and using.What they also have? For example this:
    http://www.zdnet.com/google-hires-kurzweil-a-look-at-the-returns-7000008844/

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    Originally Posted by Buts

    You really think Google will let these 100$ tools some way to learn their algorithm?
    Nobody is actually stating that. Am I wrong?
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    I'm trying to have a "healthy" conversation here,
    I think you caught the flu. Tools make the job easier if you understand how to use the different tools. Otherwise you just have a huge tool box with a lot of shinny thingies in it, that you can show yer friends. Did you purchased some of these tools thinking they were a solve all SEO issues and they didn't work?
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    Originally Posted by Buts
    No, the shelf is coming with instructions that telling me exactly what to do to succeed my "mission".

    These tools are also coming with some instructions and info about what is a good link and a bad link, if you will work as mr.forexoo said:
    Ok so you didn't like the shelf and screwdriver way of explaining to you that tools are here to help you not to give you all the answers, so here's another thought for you, one that you might grasp this time around I hope...

    Do you use analytics? If yes they why? It don't tell you how to gain more traffic, how to get a better conversion rate, or how to reduce bounce rate etc etc, so what use is it?

    The simply and short answer (to try and keep you from getting lost as you seem to find this stuff hard to grasp and understand) is, it shows you date and information that you can take away and use to better your website.

    This is just what these tools do, they give you data and information that if you know how to read and what to do with you can use to your advantage 9/10 to better your link profile and link building tactics!

    Now if you can't see that and don't want to use them, why are you even talking about them in the first place?

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    All tools have advantages and all tools have disadvantages. The greatest disadvantage with all tools is non-disclosure of the algorithmic nature of the tool itself. I may use many link checkers to compare datasets with wmt I don't use any link checker if I cannot access Google WMT... and here is why.

    Google suggests the query data for those logged into their Google accounts is privileged info and shows me an increasing amount of NOT PROVIDED. My backlinks IMHO of the same caliber "PRIVILEGED" unless you are the owner or a provider of the owner that has a "NEED TO KNOW" ... the owner can provide you access to WMT.

    Similarly what is useful to one provider is not necessarily useful to all providers. Data collection is extremely important in SEO circles but if you don't have access to wmt for a domain you generally do not need the tools you noted because they are not necessarily accurate and you have very little framework to compare with a known accuracy.

    e.g. comparing inaccurate datasets to other inaccruate datasets is just a waste of time.
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    Free tools available to all, WMT and GA and you're all set. imo
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