Thread: Link weight

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    Link weight


    Does a link to your site from a site that is listed #1 on google for it's target keyword phrase carry more weight than a site that is further down the list? Let's say that the #1 site for a search term has a pr=3 and a site that is listed #50 has a pr=6, and both sites link to your site, which link is more valuable in helping to get your site listed higher in google?
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    PR6 in this instance because a PR<4 isn't recognised - but I know what you mean. I would have thought (but am not certain) that a PR6 would bring greater weight since that inbound (however you've negotiated or earned it) indicates your site contains relevance (sensibly it should work this way).
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    I'm pretty sure that a pr <4 is recognized, it's just usually not shown in the backwards links section to save resources at google.
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    But, understanding that page rank is not the endall, does google give any more significance to links from sites that have achieved top positions for their targetted keyword phrase?
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    Link Weight Explained


    Link Weight Explained - The Bigger Picture

    Originally posted by "Rogue"



    Does a link to your site from a site that is listed #1 on google for it's target keyword phrase carry more weight than a site that is further down the list? Let's say that the #1 site for a search term has a pr=3 and a site that is listed #50 has a pr=6, and both sites link to your site, which link is more valuable in helping to get your site listed higher in google?
    Hi Rogue,

    While your question is quite vague, we will help you to understand how to phrase it in a more specific way and then you'll be able to get a better overall picture of Google's algorithm to help optimize your pages.

    A link to your Web Page from ANY (indexed non-penalized) Web Page will pass both PageRank and Link Reputation to it.

    Just how much PageRank will depend on how many other links are on the page.

    For example, the following is "The PageRank Chart" we use for illustration purposes and then we'll explain the "WEIGHT" (AKA POINTS) passed from one Web Page to another based on the page's PageRank and the number of links it contains.

    (Please keep in mind that no one but Google of course, knows the actual numbers used, but the formula is sound.)

    First, you must realize that the Google Toolbar < http://toolbar.google.com/ > displays ONLY a number from 0 to 10.

    That is NOT the REAL number for a Web Page's PageRank.

    For instance, if a Web Page shows a PageRank5 in the Google Toolbar, what is its REAL PageRank?


    .............................
    a.) 627

    ... Or possibly ...

    b.) 3106
    .............................


    The PageRank Chart

    PR1 = 0.00000001 and 5
    PR2 = 6 and 25
    PR3 = 25 and 125
    PR4 = 126 and 625
    PR5 = 626 and 3125
    PR6 = 3126 and 15625
    PR7 = 15626 and 78125
    PR8 = 78126 and 390625
    PR9 = 390626 and 1953125
    PR10 = 1953126 and infinity

    .............................
    PageRank Chart
    .............................
    PR5 = 1000
    PR6 = 10000
    PR7 = 50000
    PR8 = 100,000
    .............................

    Now, according to the above chart, a Web Page with PageRank50000 (AKA PageRank7 on the Google Toolbar) will PASS a certain amount of "WEIGHT" (AKA POINTS) to your Web Page depending on the amount of links it contains.

    1.) A Web Page with PageRank50000 (AKA PageRank7 on the Google Toolbar) that has a total of 1 link (1 link to your page) will actually pass 42500 (50000 * 0.85) in total "VOTING POWER" (AKA POINTS) and in this case 42500 (42500 divided by 1 link) to your page?

    2.) A Web Page with PageRank50000 (AKA PageRank7 on the Google Toolbar) that has a total of 10 links (1 link to your page) will actually pass 42500 (50000 * 0.85) in total "VOTING POWER" (AKA POINTS) and in this case 4250 (42500 divided by 10 links) to your page?

    PLEASE NOTE: The 0.85 is a dampening factor. Below is how PageRank is calculated.

    The Calculation of PageRank

    I'll tell you approximately how it's calculated. It's not crucial to know this; however, if you understand this you'll better understand how to properly use it.

    When Google was just a research project, they wrote a paper detailing a formula that gives the PageRank for a page. Whilst they may not still be using this exact formula, it seems pretty accurate for today's purposes. Here it is …

    PR(A) = (1-d) + d (PR(T1)/C(T1) + ... + PR(Tn)/C(Tn))

    Where PR(A) is the PageRank of Page A (the one we want to work out).

    D is a dampening factor. Nominally this is set to 0.85

    PR(T1) is the PageRank of a site pointing to Page A

    C(T1) is the number of links off that page

    PR(Tn)/C(Tn) means we do that for each page pointing to Page A

    Yikes! So for those of you that aren't mathematicians, heres the low-down on that formula – you cant simply calculate PageRank in one go like that. To calculate the PageRank of Page A you'd need to know the PageRank of all the pages pointing to Page A. Their PageRanks would in part be due to Page A pointing to them or some other site that points to them! What a silly formula. What it does tell us is one very important thing about the PageRank of any page…

    The PageRank given to Page A by a Page B pointing to it is decreased with each link to anywhere that exists on Page B. That means a page's PageRank is essentially a measure of its vote; it can split that vote between one link or two links or many more, but it's overall voting power will always be the same.



    Source: http://www-db.stanford.edu/~backrub/google.html
    The Anatomy of a Large-Scale Hypertextual Web Search Engine, Sergey Brin and Lawrence Page

    Source: http://www.searchguild.com/
    PageRank Explained or "Everything you've always wanted to know about PageRank" Written and theorized by Chris Ridings

    Here is a quick illustration to explain which of the following scenarios it is BETTER (just from a PageRank points standpoint only) to acquire a link from if you have a choice and if you can only choose one.


    If you could only choose ONE of the following Web Pages to place your Backward Link, which would you choose? ...

    1.) A link from a PageRank6 Web Page that has 10 links on it.

    ... Or ...

    2.) A link from a PageRank5 Web Page that has 2 links on it.

    In other words, which of the above 2 Web Pages will provide you with the most PageRank points if a link to your Web Page is included?


    Well, let's do the "SIMPLE" math and find out.

    PR6 = 3126 x 0.85 (Dampening Factor) = 2657 / 10 (Links) = 265.7

    PR5 = 626 x 0.85 (Dampening Factor) = 531 / 2 (Links) = 265.5


    In this example, you'll get an equal amount (well, less than a quarter of a point difference that is) of PageRank passed from either page.

    So in this example, it doesn't really matter much, but in more extreme situations it will.

    PLEASE NOTE: This is just an illustration to show you how PageRank works and not meant to discourage you from getting or giving links based on PageRank.

    REMEMBER: PageRank is only a VERY SMALL aspect of Google's algorithm and there are more important aspects so don't get caught up majoring in this minor issue.

    Our advice is to GIVE out (freely) all the links you WANT to as long as they are useful for your visitors.

    Also don't refuse a reciprocal linking opportunity simply because your page has a higher PageRank than the other Page (given that the page provides unique quality information relevant to your information).

    SEO TIP: Link out freely and you will be linked to freely (given that your provide unique quality information).

    That covers the PageRank aspect a link will pass and now will cover the Link Reputation aspect.

    A simple definition for Link Reputation would be to say that it is the "WEIGHT" (AKA POINTS) given to the keywords in a Backward Link (a link from "Web Page B" pointing to "Web Page A").

    While we are not actually able to prove that a Backward Link from a PageRank7 Web Page with 10 links passes the same amount of "WEIGHT" (AKA POINTS) as a PageRank5 Web Page with 10 links passes, we do believe that to be true.

    Therefore, acquiring Backward Links with your keyword phrase in the Anchor Tag Text or ALT Tag Text from ANY (indexed non-penalized) Web Page is crucial in acquiring high rankings for your Web Page for that keyword phrase.


    <a href=http://www.domain.com/">This Is Anchor Tag Text</a>

    <a href=http://www.domain.com/"><img src=image.jpg alt="This Is ALT Tag Text"></a>


    Now, according to our research, we believe the following scenario to be true.

    Question: Of the two situations below, which do you believe will give your Home Page < http://www.seospecialist.com/ > a higher ranking for the keyword phrase ...

    Search Engine Optimization Specialist

    1.) Having 200 Backward Links and all from PageRank6 Web Pages with an average of 20 links on each page and all with your URL as the Anchor Tag Text?

    <a href=http://www.seospecialist.com/">http://www.seospecialist.com</a>

    ... Or ...

    2.) Having 30 Backward Links and all from PageRank4 Web Pages with an average of 20 links on each page and all with your URL as the Anchor Tag Text?

    <a href=http://www.seospecialist.com/">Search Engine Optimization Specialist</a>


    If you believe it to be the second situation with the 30 Backward Links, then you are in agreement with what we believe.

    Your Friends,

    Sharon & Roy
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    Sharon & Roy: thank's for taking the time. I fried my head with similar from you on another board a while back but that went straight in. Good read. Thanks.
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    Dear Sharon & Roy,
    While at it, a particular aspect of PR calculation continues to confound me. Hope you can help.

    I refer to one of the papers:
    http://www.iprcom.com/papers/pagerank/

    See Example 2

    In a hierarchial structure, (Example 2 in this paper) why do all the three sub-pages have the same PR although one of those sub-pages is 'leaking' its PR to 3 external websites.
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    Excellent post, Sharon & Roy.

    See also The Anatomy of a Large-Scale Hypertextual Web Search Engine, it is really interesting.
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    Originally posted by "semo"

    Excellent post, Sharon & Roy.

    See also The Anatomy of a Large-Scale Hypertextual Web Search Engine, it is really interesting.

    Whats this???

    You wrote excellent Post - and then you give us an URL that was already written down here in this Thread. Great Job Thanks.
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    you can find simply more detail information below the link.

    S&R have summarized it very well.

    It is not desired to post additional information?
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    Originally posted by "semo"

    you can find simply more detail information below the link.

    S&R have summarized it very well.

    It is not desired to post additional information?
    Sure, its ok. But this Link was already posted by Sharon&Roy. Thats was what i mean
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    my mistake, sorry.
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    Understanding PageRank Leak


    How Important Is PageRank Leak?

    It is not important at all and certainly nothing to worry about.

    This is a case of not majoring in a minor issue, and believe us when we say that PageRank Leak is not just a minor issue, it is a REALLY minor issue.

    Originally posted by "arun_g"



    Dear Sharon & Roy,

    While at it, a particular aspect of PR calculation continues to confound me. Hope you can help.

    I refer to one of the papers:

    http://www.iprcom.com/papers/pagerank/

    See Example 2

    In a hierarchial structure, (Example 2 in this paper) why do all the three sub-pages have the same PR although one of those sub-pages is 'leaking' its PR to 3 external websites.

    Hi arun_g,

    Good question, and without being really technical here, we'll put things in perspective for you by asking you some questions.

    1. That illustration you refer to, do you know what iteration (repeating the calculation over and over) it's on?

    a.) 1

    b.) 5

    c.) 20

    d.) 40


    The author states ...

    Getting the answer quicker

    How many times do we need to repeat the calculation for big networks? That's a difficult question; for a network as large as the World Wide Web it can be many millions of iterations! The "damping factor" is quite subtle. If it's too high then it takes ages for the numbers to settle, if it's too low then you get repeated over-shoot, both above and below the average - the numbers just swing about the average like a pendulum and never settle down.

    Also choosing the order of calculations can help. The answer will always come out the same no matter which order you choose, but some orders will get you there quicker than others.

    I'm sure there's been several Master's Thesis on how to make this calculation as efficient as possible, but, in the examples below, I've used very simple code for clarity and roughly 20 to 40 iterations were needed!

    2.) Do you realize that those numbers in the illustration that you refer to are the total PageRank points PASSED to that page from ALL other pages POINTING to it and NOT the PageRank points PASSED to that page minus the PageRank points passed onto the pages it links to?

    In other words, those numbers are the BEFORE numbers and NOT the AFTER numbers.

    In still other words, there are 5 "Forward Links" (A link from "Web Page A" TO "Web Page B") from the bottom sub-page, where 4 links are "leaking" PageRank and 1 link is NOT leaking PageRank.

    3.) Do you realize that if the 1 link to the Home Page was not there, that the amount of PageRank Leak would be greater?

    4.) Do you realize that if you add 2 more links to the other 2 sub-pages that the amount of PageRank Leak would be less?

    Here is our advise.

    a.) Don't worry about PageRank Leak, not for even one millisecond.

    b.) If you do worry about PageRank Leak, you can minimize the amount you leak by adding one or more Webpages for every link to another domain (Outbound Link). The more pages you add per Outbound Link, the less PageRank you will leak.

    SEO TIP: Don't MAJOR on the MINORS - PageRank is such a minor issue, so don't even think about it, because whether you think about it or not, PageRank will happen and your PageRank will increase as long as you do OTHER things PROPERLY, so make sure you don't get caught up into thinking that you NEED to hoard your Outbound Links in order to KEEP your PageRank so that you will rank higher. Nothing Could Be Further From The Truth -- What a horrible trap to fall into and what a terrible myth to buy into, so don't go there.

    Simply link ALL of your Interior Web Pages to your Home Page with your PRIMARY Keyword Phrase in the Anchor Tag Text and then keep your Navigation Menu the SAME on all of your pages. (Of course, certain pages will have different links, but they should be above and beyond your Navigation Menu links.)


    FURTHER INSIGHT:

    We delight in helping to put PageRank into perspective for folks like yourself who have read advice about it from others who may not have explained it well enough for you to know that PageRank is not something you need to even think about, because it just happens.

    Here are just a few facts you need to know about PageRank.

    1.) PageRank is NOT as powerful as you "may" think it is. It is the VERY LAST calculation performed in Google's algorithm.

    2.) PageRank is Google's opinion of how important a page is in the absence of any queries, which means it is really quite useless when there is a query (PageRank is calculated WELL AFTER all the pages matching the query are returned). Think about it this way, none of the other search engines use PageRank in their algorithms and generally speaking, if your Webpage ranks well in Google, the same is true of the other search engines, and your page will rank well there too (assuming that it has been CORRECTLY optimized).

    3.) Remember this. You will automatically increase your PageRank by adding pages to your site (now don't think that 100 pages will equal a certain amount and 10,000 will equal another certain amount, as PageRank doesn't calculate that way). Link all interior pages to the Home Page and the Site Map Page. Link to every interior page from your Site Map page and limit your links to around 50 per page on your Site Map if you prefer them all on as few pages as possible, but actually, the less links per page the better PageRank wise that is, but remember that PageRank is not that important. Create a Navigation Menu that will link to around a dozen or so of your most important pages and create great "Link Reputation" for these pages by selecting the best keywords to place in the Anchor Tag Text, meaning that instead of saying ... Home Page ... say ... Small Business Development. We always advise to place your PRIMARY Keyword Phrase as the text to use in your links. Use Text Links. If you don't use Text Links, then place your PRIMARY Keyword Phrase in the ALT Tag Text of your Image Link. Then add at least one (or several) Web Pages (in the way of articles or resources, reviews, etc.) to your site each and every week and link to it and from it as discussed previously. Also work on acquiring as many Backward Links as possible each week and make sure they are Text Links that include YOUR PRIMARY Keyword Phrase. Do this and your PageRank will SKYROCKET, but even better than that, your Web Page(s) will SKYROCKET for your PRIMARY Keyword Phrase(s).

    4.) While links to your Web Pages by themselves are important, the keywords in the links to your Web Pages are MORE important.


    SEO TIP: "THINK LINK" That's right, think about what keywords you want your Web Page to rank high for and then make sure that you AND others put those keywords in the links that POINT to your Web Page(s). Then to insure that you OPTIMIZE your Web Page for those keywords, place those keywords in all of your ...


    .............................

    KEYWORD PLACES

    • Backward Link (Anchor Tag/ALT Tag)
    • HTML Title Tag
    • Meta Description Tag
    • Meta Keywords Tag (If you use one.)
    • Body Tag (The Visible Text) (Develop your copy in a professional way. Write for your target audience, and don't set a specific number to repeat your keywords. Allow your text to flow. Don't write for the search engines, write for your target audience so that you can convert them into sales or subscribers. Do keep in mind but don't get caught up into wanting to reach a specific percentage for ... Keyword Density, Keyword Prominence, Keyword Proximity and Keyword Order. We advise to use between 250 words to 600 words.)
    • Anchor Tag
    • ALT Tag
    • Heading Tag
    • Strong/Bold Tag
    • Italic/Emphasis Tag
    • Underline Tag
    • Domain/Directory/File Name (If POSSIBLE and without sounding SPAMMY - Keywords here are NOT given much direct weight at all, so don't fret if your domain name has no keywords at all. A keyword rich Directory/File Name will become extremely advantageous when it comes to how others will link to your pages. Providing a Link To Us Page with a few choices is highly recommended. Do NOT leave anything to chance when it comes to SEO.)
    .............................


    In summary, please don't misinterpret what we said earlier.

    We never said to IGNORE PageRank or PageRank Leak ... As you should absolutely be AWARE of what it is and what it does, but we said don't worry about it. Meaning, "playing" with how you link here or there or from or to. Just allow your links to be free to link where it makes sense for your visitors. See what we are saying?


    Your Friends,

    Sharon & Roy
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    Very nice posts Shanon & Roy, nice job!
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    Originally posted by "enigma"

    Sharon & Roy: thank's for taking the time. I fried my head with similar from you on another board a while back but that went straight in. Good read. Thanks.
    Screw PR - You will often see pages with lower PR be much better ranked than pages with a high PR....it totally depends on the relevancy of your page to the search term. All I have seen PR be directly relevant to is the frequency with which google stops by to say hi to you.
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