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    How to beat the current No 1


    Following all the advice on here I have managed to greatly increase my results in searches but there are still sites that appear higher.
    Having checked I have a higher PR than them, I have pages indexed than them and I have more backlinks into my site than them (they have about 5000 and I have over 20000). I also have a higher Alexa ranking.

    The one thing I can see different is that they have far more reciprocal links than I do.

    Does anyone have any ideas?

    thanks
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  3. Smoke me a kipper...
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    Your PR won't directly determine your position in the SERPs, and your Alexa rank has no influence at all.

    Although you have more back links than them, quantity alone is not a useful measure:-

    How many different sites link to them -- if all your back links come from just a few sites, then you have far fewer useful links than you imagine.

    How many of your back links are nofollowed? How many are likely to be devalued by Google? How many are on deep pages with little link juice to feed to your site?

    How many of your back links are from high quality, relevant sites in comparison with your competitor's links? How old are your back links in comparison with your competitor's links?

    How well optimised is your own site for the target search terms in comparison with your competitor's site?

    Your competitor may have quite a few reciprocal links, but if they're all to high quality, relevant authority sites, then they'll still be valuable.
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  5. from the horses mouth
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    Alexa ranking is worth nothing in terms of your rankings.

    It is probably that they have better quality and more relevant backlinks.

    Sheer volume of backlinks is not as important as the cumulative quality of your backlinks.
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    Alexa ranking is based on the quality and related backlinks to a site.I think Alexa ranking does not give accurate results for the site but some site used this as a basis of traffic or ranking.

    The one thing I can see different is that they have far more reciprocal links than I do.

    There is no problem with less reciprocal links.According to Google guidelines, excessive reciprocal links or links that is not related to your site might harm your site and it will penalize your site. The only advantages of reciprocal links is that they give traffic and can rank well in a related keywords.

    thanks
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    Originally Posted by guia
    Alexa ranking is based on the quality and related backlinks to a site.I think Alexa ranking does not give accurate results for the site but some site used this as a basis of traffic or ranking.
    Alexa rank is based on the number of users with the Alexa toolbar installed visiting your site. It has nothing to do with links.

    Comments on this post

    • SEO_AM agrees : In SEO... Alexa is meaningless.
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    SERP placement is determined primarily by content and backlink relevance to the search query NOT quantity or PR of backlinks. The SERP winner has more relevant and/or higher quality links.

    Comments on this post

    • JagNet agrees : very neatly summed up
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    Originally Posted by JagNet
    How many of your back links are nofollowed? How many are likely to be devalued by Google? How many are on deep pages with little link juice to feed to your site?
    No follow links from quality sites are also useful for SE placement. The only thing you won't get from them is PR juice.
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    Originally Posted by Megamix
    No follow links from quality sites are also useful for SE placement.
    How do you come to that conclusion? If the link is nofollowed it says "don't count this link as a vote for the site" and the link is removed from the back link calculations used to determine relevancy, and ultimately search result positions.
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    Originally Posted by Megamix
    No follow links from quality sites are also useful for SE placement. The only thing you won't get from them is PR juice.
    hmm I have to disagree,. this can't help at all since it didn't passes on link juice or can help to improve SERP,.

    Another thing, although you have more backlinks than the other one, what counts is the quality of every backlinks not the quantity of it,.
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    Originally Posted by JagNet
    How do you come to that conclusion? If the link is nofollowed it says "don't count this link as a vote for the site" and the link is removed from the back link calculations used to determine relevancy, and ultimately search result positions.
    It says "don't count the link as a vote for the site" when it comes to the PR algorithm not SE placement.

    Actually I have noticed that lately Google seems to put more weight on "no follow" links than before.

    As an example... I run a web directory where I manually add high quality websites for relevant categories with "no-follow" atribute. In several cases I have noticed that my no-follow backlink rank pretty high when you search for the respective websites (several 1st and 2nd page positions) even for old, well established, authority websites.

    If Google see my no-follow link so useful and place it high in searhes it clearly indicates that they start putting more weight on no-follows.

    At the end...they are the ones who preach to add no follow tags to the links you charge for...
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  21. Smoke me a kipper...
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    Originally Posted by Megamix
    As an example... I run a web directory where I manually add high quality websites for relevant categories with "no-follow" atribute. In several cases I have noticed that my no-follow backlink rank pretty high when you search for the respective websites (several 1st and 2nd page positions) even for old, well established, authority websites.
    So you're saying that your site ranks well for the term contained within the nofollow link rather than the linked-to site ranking well because of it?
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    Originally Posted by JagNet
    So you're saying that your site ranks well for the term contained within the nofollow link rather than the linked-to site ranking well because of it?
    No, I did not said that.

    I'm saying that I have submited Example.com which is a quality website in its niche to my directory with a no-follow link.

    Once the link detail page gets indexed it appears pretty high when you search for the respective site.

    Here is an example.

    A few days back have added to my directory Arup.com which is an authority site in construction and engineering niche.

    If you do a search for " Arup Construction" my site comes on the first page, fourth result and it is a no-follow link...which clearly indicates that Google put some sort of weight on my no follow link.
    Please check the link below... my directory is Zyas.com

    http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Arup+Construction&btnG=Search

    I took some time to research a few other websites and I have discovered this for at least 15 - 20 websites...you may want to search by yourself.

    Hope this helps

    Thanks
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    Your site is ranking well for this term primarily because of the content in your title element matching exactly the search term. try this

    You cannot deduce from this that arup.com receive any benefit from your nofollowed link. You could remove the link and place "Arup Construction" as standard text in its place and your page would be unaffected, as would Arup's own site.
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    Originally Posted by JagNet
    Your site is ranking well for this term primarily because of the content in your title element matching exactly the search term. try this

    You cannot deduce from this that arup.com receive any benefit from your nofollowed link. You could remove the link and place "Arup Construction" as standard text in its place and your page would be unaffected, as would Arup's own site.
    While I understand the title tag plays a major role in this it is still questionable why google choosed to rank my no follow link higher than other do follow websites that have the same kw in their title (noticed some article websites).

    I cannot deduce that Arup is getting any benefit from this link as well as you cannot deduce that Arup is not getting any benefit at all.

    If you'll further research on some other nofollow links from my site you will notice that I rank higher without having the kws in the title.

    A quick example I could find now is BADA.org where I rank second for the detail page which has this title text and also I rank #20 for a subcategory which has the title tag "Zyas Video Directory / Arts / Antiques" - totally different from the "BADA.org" search title.
    There are some other submissions where I rank higher for the URL rather than the anchor text or even some alphabetical pages rank higher than the title text.

    I'm not trying to prove anything and I'm not going to reinvent the wheel here. All I'm trying to say is that some no-follow links might rank higher then other do-follow links which from my point of view means that Google is putting some sort of weight on them. I'm afraid I won't be able to prove this black on white on paper as well as I don't think you will be able to prove the search engines don't put ANY sort of weight on no-follow links.

    It is clear that no one will get any sort of PR juice benefits from nofollows but I think it might help on the rankings somehow. Just a thought...don't shoot the messenger!
    Last edited by Megamix; Jan 11th, 2008 at 10:25 AM.
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    No no no no no no no

    Google isn't ranking your nofollow link higher, it's ranking your page as a whole. The fact that you have a link on there which is nofollowed is neither here nor there.

    You mentioned other sites having the same keywords in your title, but my example search for allintitle:"Arup Construction" shows only your site (different datacenters could show others as well) which generally means that there is little competition for a general search for Arup Construction. To achieve #4 then when your page his highly optimised for this search phrase isn't actually a great accomplishment to be honest.

    Anyway, going back to the original point, not only is no PR passed through a nofollowed link, but neither is any relevance. The only thing the linked-to site might gain is traffic. That's all, nothing more. It's not inconceivable that Google may choose to ignore the nofollow tag in certain circumstances (that's up to them if they do), but I have seen no evidence of it as yet, and I really wouldn't expect them to do so for a directory (no offense intended towards directory owners).
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