Feels like my site is bobbing up and down

Hi All

Last week all my pages seemed down and were dropping down to 3rd-4th page I questioned my strategy, wondered what I was doing wrong etc.

This week i've got a higher number of first pages than ever before and my rankings are improving..

It feels like the whole site is bobbing up and down like it's on a tide!

I don't do anything blackhat or underhand, it's a well established site with decent levels of traffic.

Does anyone else get this?

My site same you, maybe this is google dance. I notice some site up fast and next down fast too.

If your site up or down slowly, it's safe. But too fast is dangerous.

'swhy we call it "serp churn" or "serp waves" -- cause they do just that!

so get used to it....ie cope....or go lie on a beach!



Jim

The reason is generally explained with the following:

1) you are a newish web site (under 1 year)
2) you don't have enough incoming web links

1 you have to wait, but you can fix one with 2. 2 you can always work on.

Conclusion, roll with 2 like you wash your hair (rinse wash repeat)

I've just taken on an intern for directory submission and general link building. Going to improve the product copy on the pages and where possible add more content.

Also going to do some article spinning, hopefully will build some inbounds, should I drive my inbounds to the homepage and hope for trickle down or target each of my categories (there are around 50) individually, focusing initially on my priority targets.

an intern.....gee..does he wear a mask and a labcoat like all medical interns?

hope so....ie that he's a medical intern...cause a non-medical intern will need SOME training, constant supervision, vision training and more....much much more....

let us know how you do, tho...would 'ya? I'd think that an intern will be of NO real link building help..but then you might'a actually gotten someone who won't surf all day and just complain how tough link building really is, eh...

nah. that's who you got, eh!



Jim

Marketing budgets are tight at the moment so sadly all I can get (at least until ROI proven) is an intern.. my job is not exclusively (or even primarily SEO) She had her first day on Friday and I've been training her what I've learned.

I'll let you know how we get on, there are other tasks for her to help on as well and clearly with no SEO experience it add's more work to me rather than helping!

Still good opportunity to get lots of manual work done on submissions, contacting bloggers with our product, article writing and copywriting.

Also good for her (as a graduate) to gain experience and learn about working in Online marketing.

I'll keep you posted.

I have also observed this phenomenon. It looks like Google Dance to me. SHAKE YOUR BOOTY

all true....ie the job tasks you've listed, but no where near complete....

not to ask to much, but is this for one site? what channel? which g are you targeting? at all LOCAL or global? do you own this site? or is it for a client? have you established a target # of links for this intern to get on a weekly basis? any dirs that can help here in that channel?

?

Jim

It's for one site a furniture/homewares retailer (lombok.co.uk) who I primarily manage web content and email marketing for. We're Targeting Google UK. I haven't set a target number of links yet and probably won't (thinking that it's quality over quantity)

Initially I've created lists of target keywords for each category based on relevance to the company and of search volumes in adwords.
I've then been adjusting content and text on site to contain these words and ensure page titles etc reflect them too.

I've shown the intern how to analyse the back links of competitor pages and have started on one category to try and get our site listed on the same directories, blog rolls etc as the sites which are performing well.

I also intend for her to do some article writing on content like 'what your bookcase says about you' '5 ways to style your bookcase' etc.

Would you have other suggestions to add to this or other ways of building links etc?

I'm already pushing for better content on the pages about where the products come from, how they're made to hopefully improve the content on the page and make it draw more links naturally but this will be Feb-March next year.

Please assess my strategy!

Just took a quick look/see...and so far what I can offer is that you've surely begun correctly if a bit "spotty" -- (other than the slow load of the home page?) for on-page items for a dynamic site. Titles look good, but I might lengthen some up to at least 70 if not 95 chars....tho I'd only add the Lombok name at the END of each string, ie use the first 70 for keywords.

Don't have the time for a point by point diagnosis, but for instance, I do not see you using many alt image tags for an example. So I'd receomment that you go to seomoz and scour the site for Rand's list of on-page basics....you're missing quite a few of same, easy to learn and quick to add and they DO carry juice!

Again for instance, you have an <h1> on pages, but I see no <h2>s where there could be some value - say as the re-used title for the dbase pulls for an item's name....this can HELP nicely as it reinforces the juice that G gives for the item name. You do however use them on a 'master' page to show say ALL the Cupboards & Dressers, but then drill down and there's no <h2> being used again, a small trick but one Inever ever miss!

Long tail terms too need some work, both title wise and img alt wise too....but on the whole great start....if you teach this methodology to an intern, you may just be training a 'competitor-to-be!"

Oh, Lombok? It's an island in Indonesia....why'd that name get used? A quick wiki shows no link tween that brand name and 'furniture' ??? just wondderin is all?

:-)

Jim

PS nice to have you here...stick around, eh! newbies here come 'n go by the dozens every week...but not with the skillset I see for that site!

I am curious about this recommendation. Why? I understand that Google displays titles up to 70 chars (The Art of SEO says "in some cases"), including spaces. But what's the point of keeping them long? I would say keep them short. Ideally you optimize a page for just one keyword, two at most. Long title tags dilute the keyword theme. I do recommend using additional relevant keywords in the title, after the page's root keyword (this is for the user, but also to establish thematic richness and also to minimize over-optimization concerns). But why max them out, especially beyond 70 chars? Enquiring minds want to know (as we used to say in the days of Usenet).

you "understand?" ie you're listening to others, right? NO....THAT'S WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!

believe not a one of us...but do listen to our advice...and then TEST TEST TES!!!

I.E....right now, ie 4 days ago, IE and Safari (< 4.0) will show 95 chars....FF and Chrome over 150+ chars.... so if you want to see what you CAN use, then test test test all the time and for all you need to use as tactics...and the right "number" of keywords per page is again, a tested item, channel by channel fo our client base. 1? 2? 4? the number isn't as important as the useage of same on each page...follow me here?

ie your "understanding" is fine...but it changes all the time...right now the IE (the business NA browser)says 95 works...so change to 95 chars...but test so that each week you stay ahead of the curve...

and to be honest we have some longtail keyword phrases in titles that run 130+ chars....you'd be amazed at what "works" in some channels in some browsers....eh!

so, you 'inquiring' minds...test test test ...and learn....and we're talking TITLE only here...multiply that by the 200+ item Google algo..and you've got a life's work here, eh!



Jim

Interesting response, Jim. I do believe in test-test-test, as you put it. I have a background in software and have been testing this SEO stuff for a goodly number of years now (pity that it goes out of date so fast). I also "understand" (yup, through my mind's considerable powers ) that one can't test the whole SEO domain thoroughly by oneself, and that people's test results are different. I am keenly interested in other people's tests and results, without, however, accepting them blindly. When I ask, in an SEO forum, "why [do you say this]?" what I mean by that is "What are your results? please share them," which was my intention in the first place. This is not a business where anyone's words should be taken for granted (we sometimes get obsolete, or even downright bad, advice even from top professionals). Yet the voluntary sharing information is a beautiful thing.

So that was a long aside, and now back to the meat of the dinner. Would you mind talking a bit more about your experience with very long long-tail keywords (I am fascinated by those myself, though I haven't yet been able to use search phrases longer than 3-4 words successfully and consistently) and with long title tags? If you say I'd be amazed, I am eager be amazed. Please share more.

I've been bouncing back and forth between page 1 and 2 on Google for a while. I haven't done anything with seo for a while now, been busy with other things. Now my site is around 6 or 7th place on page one. I didn't do anything to get it higher. The only thing I can think of is the timing. The site is over a year old now. Is there any 'magic' in that? Time does play a role but to what extent?