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    #31
  1. B afraid.. B very afraid!
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    Legal proceedings are not cheap and there is almost no guarantee that a judge or jury will see or act on "the truth". Sometimes even when the facts in the case are totally in your favor, a judge or jury will disagree. In one case, after we presented all the evidence and testimony, the judge said that I could more afford the money than the party I was suing. He found for the other party. When my attorney complained, the judge just said "appeal my decision if you want to". It was an open and shut case that I lost. I never appealed.
  2. #32
  3. rod@missionop.com
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    Originally Posted by SEO_AM
    Legal proceedings are not cheap and there is almost no guarantee that a judge or jury will see or act on "the truth". Sometimes even when the facts in the case are totally in your favor, a judge or jury will disagree. In one case, after we presented all the evidence and testimony, the judge said that I could more afford the money than the party I was suing. He found for the other party. When my attorney complained, the judge just said "appeal my decision if you want to". It was an open and shut case that I lost. I never appealed.
    I wouldn't appeal an unfavorable ruling either. I have accepted every risk I have taken over the years and while some haven't panned out that is the natural of business advertising in general.

    This is simply an extension of that.

    Google desires high quality content and rewards that but if I must produce that, I MUST protect it ...so this is that.

    <added>My point in making this public is show a case of genuine results based on Google's ideas of best SEO practices that rewards high quality websites.

    I took the risk and this customer got the rewards of my risk taking without needing to worry about any risks other than compensating me fairly for managing those risks. They unilaterally decided they paid enough and I disagree.

    If there is no value for any SEO to take risk off the table it would be better to keep risk on the table and charge customers fairly for that exclusive right. To own RISK OUTRIGHT! (risks & rewards are the same thing. Pretending you can or can't own one without the other is what this dispute is all about).

    My model intentions were originally to protect my content from being infringed on by scrappers. It's my content, I commissioned it to be created, paid exclusively for it, had to deal with writer issues and develop terms with them, registered it with the Copyright Office and only then did we post it... anyone can do a search of the archive to see that it is registered under our name. ...then settle claims based on the merits of each case privately.

    Peter - while you have mentioned your own legal battles I search for anything registered in your name or your business name and found nothing. You can't protect your rights without registering them. So are we discussing the same thing here. This isn't about fair use. I recall from your PANDA issue-days you had a large amount of fair use content which cannot be registered.

    Unfortunately, this was the first infringement that occurred. Not due to scrapping but due to old beliefs that were defunct the moment PENGUIN was introduced. Unnatural Links vs Natural Links.

    Ignorance of the law isn't a valid position to put before the courts and while this is merely my opinion... Ignorance of Google stance on webspam does not afford you the ability to delete the terms of your contract and replace those with whatever suits your current position.

    e.g. I own your copyright... no I do.


    I could indeed be wrong but willing to bet I'm not.
    </added>
    Last edited by fathom; Apr 2nd, 2015 at 05:49 PM.
  4. #33
  5. B afraid.. B very afraid!
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    Originally Posted by fathom
    ... while you have mentioned your own legal battles I search for anything registered in your name or your business name and found nothing. You can't protect your rights without registering them. So are we discussing the same thing here. This isn't about fair use. I recall from your PANDA issue-days you had a large amount of fair use content which cannot be registered.
    I was referring to legal matters when I was in the corporate world within the high tech community. I retired several years back. Current online activity is hobby/sideline to augment retirement set income. It also takes up some or my retirement time.

    I had some issues on my current website a couple of times when others were scraping my glossary and using it. Most times the site owners were unaware, they claimed, of what their developers were doing. Once notified and threatened they took the content down. I changed the glossary design to make it much more difficult to scrape that content.
    Last edited by SEO_AM; Apr 3rd, 2015 at 06:16 AM.
    ...Never mistake activity for achievement...

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  6. #34
  7. rod@missionop.com
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    Originally Posted by SEO_AM
    I was referring to legal matters when I was in the corporate world within the high tech community. I retired several years back. Current online activity is hobby/sideline to augment retirement set income. It also takes up some or my retirement time.

    I had some issues on my current website a couple of times when others were scraping my glossary and using it. Most times the site owners were unaware, they claimed, of what their developers were doing. Once notified and threatened they took the content down. I changed the glossary design to make it much more difficult to scrape that content.
    So your cautionary references were completely unrelated to Copyright, where your "open & shut" case afforded the judge to make law not just follow it.

    Sounds a lot like the merits of "keyword density".

    I welcome the feedback even if unrelated but would have thought it would be important to point out what type of law you were discussing. There is no ambiguity here I cannot step into a courtroom of law until I have the evidence of Copyright. That is being held by the legislative office accountable for Copyrights in the USA.

    There is no wiggle room as far as losing a decision. What it will cost is the judges discretion.

    <added>when I started this thread there were contract law questions that the defendant could sue my affiliate for damages or may file as a counterclaim as a defense against my claim. But as the defendant clearly states they have no documents with us directly, they knew I had a claim of copyright they could have freely verified that by reviewing the Copyright Offices online database. The fact that to gain access to the blogs they had to circumvent admin level login privileges, enable the content and purposely changed the login codes to prevent the Copyright Holder's access bolsters my case.

    The terms of the contract spells out unnatural links which they never got as a preventive measure to avoid PENGUIN - I'll gladly subpeona Matt Cutts to illustrate this for the court. If we need to go this route.

    I have a WIN that I will push through heaven & high water to determine what is inside my mystery prize.</added>
    Last edited by fathom; Apr 3rd, 2015 at 11:05 AM.
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  9. B afraid.. B very afraid!
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    All evidence being on your side does not necessarily mean you will win in court. Evidence is only one part of the puzzle in the courtroom. The attorneys, judge, and, if utilized, jurors do not always come to an obvious conclusion/decision. Any court proceeding is a crap shoot: criminal, contract, copyright, patent, etc. My son-in-law is a managing partner of one of the best intellectual property law partnerships in San Francisco. They win some they think they will lose and lose some obvious winners. Biggest example... O.J. Simpson.
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  11. rod@missionop.com
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    Originally Posted by SEO_AM
    All evidence being on your side does not necessarily mean you will win in court. Evidence is only one part of the puzzle in the courtroom. The attorneys, judge, and, if utilized, jurors do not always come to an obvious conclusion/decision. Any court proceeding is a crap shoot: criminal, contract, copyright, patent, etc. My son-in-law is a managing partner of one of the best intellectual property law partnerships in San Francisco. They win some they think they will lose and lose some obvious winners. Biggest example... O.J. Simpson.
    I understand the nuances but I want to see what is behind door #1 ... if it's O.J. Simpson with a glove that don't fit you must acquit! I'll be shocked.
  12. #37
  13. rod@missionop.com
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    Had a strategy session today with our attorney.

    Opposing counsel has not contacted him yet. My attorney is heading on vacation but will be back working on April 27, 2015 which if we have not heard from opposing counsel by then have authorized our attorney to prepare a lawsuit and to bill me for it.

    Not prepared to file a lawsuit with Federal Court just yet until the defendant demonstrates they have no interest in settling but also not willing to afford a deep pocket business to simply bluff their way across the finish line.
  14. #38
  15. rod@missionop.com
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    It appears the Copyright infringing pages have been disabled.

    Google was able to crawl and cache a page on Apr 12, 2015 04:51:18 GMT for the last time.
  16. #39
  17. B afraid.. B very afraid!
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    Originally Posted by fathom
    It appears the Copyright infringing pages have been disabled.

    Google was able to crawl and cache a page on Apr 12, 2015 04:51:18 GMT for the last time.
    Was this them or the host? Many times folks talk a good fight while they evaluate chances and/or costs of winning. It usually comes down to a business decision. They may have decided through counsel that you would likely prevail. Good work.
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  19. rod@missionop.com
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    Originally Posted by SEO_AM
    Was this them or the host? Many times folks talk a good fight while they evaluate chances and/or costs of winning. It usually comes down to a business decision. They may have decided through counsel that you would likely prevail. Good work.
    This is likely due to legal advice.
  20. #41
  21. B afraid.. B very afraid!
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    Originally Posted by fathom
    This is likely due to legal advice.
    I bet they were told that if it went to trial that they would most likely lose. Again... good work.
  22. #42
  23. rod@missionop.com
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    Frankly I'm a little confused now.

    The pages were all disabled but now are re-enabled which does not suggest anything at all.

    Although I double-checked the domain and non-infringing pages were active at the same time to rule out a server crash and Internet node issues.
  24. #43
  25. B afraid.. B very afraid!
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    Sorry to hear. With them removing just the offending pages then reinstating them is confusing at best. The decision-maker stuttered, i.e. off then on? Weird.
  26. #44
  27. rod@missionop.com
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    Originally Posted by SEO_AM
    Sorry to hear. With them removing just the offending pages then reinstating them is confusing at best. The decision-maker stuttered, i.e. off then on? Weird.
    The left hand & right hand have different ideas and IT is simply doing what they are told... is my best guess.

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